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IThe Need for Winter Gardens.…
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The Need for Winter Gardens. -I Expressions of Opinion at a Town's Meeting. I About a hundred townspeople, among whom were five or six ladies, attended a town's meet- ing held in the Council Chamber on Friday evening. Paragraphs announcing the meeting had been published in Thursday's local papers, and the following letter had been circulated:- African Institute, Colwyn Bay, Tuesday, Nov. 16th, 1909. Dear Sir, At a meeting of many important ratepayers, held at the Council Chamiber, on Friday even- ing, the 12th inst., it was decided that I should convene a Town's Meeting on Friday next, the 19th inst., to be held at 8 p.m., in the Council Chamber, with a view of con- sidering the advisability of erecting a perma- nent Pavilion for the holding of the 1910 National Eisteddfod and other purposes. As this is a vital question for Colwyn. Bay and district, I sincerely hope you will be able to be present. Yours faithfully, W. HUGHES (Convener). Among those present were Mrs. Kirkpatridk, the Rev. Thomas Parry, J.P., Councillors the Rev. W. Hughes, J. Berth Jones, J.P., Joseph Dicken, J.P., Samuel Jones, T. R. Davies; Messrs. J. Tucker, W. Williams (Oakfield), J. Schofield, S. C. Foulkes, J. Jones (Dinorben), Jones (Clwyd Villa), Davies (Glan Conway Villa), Edward Salisbury (Laburnum), Roberts (Public Benefit Boot Co.), Captain Thomas Roberts (Peri House), T. Parry (plumber), Mor- ris Ellis, E. R. Gibbons, J. W. Adamson, S. Johnston, H. V. Doughty Davies, J. Kyffin Wil- liams (Liverpool House), Walter Wilkinson, G. Marfell, E. Francis Evans (Penrhyn-road), Wm. Jones, C.E., Jos. H. Roberts, D. Llewelyn Jones (chemist), Alfred Allen, R. Ll. Samuel, J. R. Jones (Lancaster House), C. R. Chaplin, S. Kyffin Williams (Clock Stores), F. J. Holmes, J. O. Jones (London Housel. Simon Williams (The Compton), Thomas Edwards (Penrhyn- road), Ross (Royal Restaurant). James Arundale, Edward Jones (Powysland), E. D. Jones (grocer), J. Kyffin Jones (Greenwich House), Henry Mor- ris (Freelands), Pryce T. Williams (West End Stores), Owen Lloyd (Pendorlan), A. N. Cross, &c. Councillor J. Dicken propüsed that the chair be taken by Councillor J. Berth Jones, and this was seconded by Mrs. Kirkpatrick and carried. The Chairman This meeting has been called to test the feeling of the town upon this ques- tion, and I don't know what is the best way to get around it. Perhaps someone will say some- thing upon it. We have no agenda or anything, Mr. J. W. Adamson I understand the Eis- teddfod Committee has passed a resoLution. that the pavilion be in a certain quarter of the town. What relation has this meeting to the Eistedd- fod Committee? Are we to undo their work, or is it an expression of opinion as, to whether we should support their resolution? The Chairman It makes no difference. The Eisteddfod Committee will have to get a pavil- ion, for which they will pay f. 1,000 or ^i,.ioo or £ 1,200, and they will have to pay for the temporary building. If we are going to have a permanent hall, that money will be paid to the company, if we are going to form a company to make a permanent pavilion. Mr Adamson That scarcely answers my ques- tion. I want to know what relation this meet- ing has to the other meeting that passed a re- solution to acquire for a time a certain pro- perty in the town for the purpose of a pavilion. The Chairman said he could not tell. Councillor Dicken said he had come for in- formation, but as he understood the matter the Eisteddfod Committee would have to erect a building which might cost them about £ 1,400. He supposed the object of the meeting was to consider whether a permanent buildin? could be put up, at of course a much larger cost, towards -which this .r 1,400 would be paid by the Eistedd- fod Committee. Perhaps the Rev. W. Hughes knew more about it than anyone else. THE MIDDLE OF THE TOWN." Rev. W. Hughes You will see by the circular that this is a town's meeting. It has nothing whatever to do with the Eisteddfod Committee. They have asked me to call a meeting to con- sider the advisability of putting up a permanent pavilion. I take it that we are going to be loyal to that Eisteddfod Committee, and we cannot consider any plot of land unless we get the per- mission from the Eisteddfod Committee. They have decided upon that land, and I take it-un- less you wish to undo what the Committee has done. I take it you don't. It is for the Eis- teddfod Committee themselves to rescind it. I don't know if they can rescind it. I take it that the bulk of the business men want it in the middle of the town. Therefore, we are called to consider the advisability of build- ing a permanent pavilion. Some don't want to spend £ 1,400 in vain, and think that a perman- ent pavilion is required for Colwyn Bay. We do need such a place in this town. I am very much in favour of a permanent pavilion. I am in favour of being loyal to the Eisteddfod Com- mittee. and having it on that site, and don't be- lieve in undoing what a big Committee has done. It was a large Committee, the largest we have had for months, and I think it is rather dis- loyal for anyone to try to undo the business that has been done by that Committee. Therefore, I should like to know your opinion. I think it would be well for you to express your opinion whether you want a permanent one. FORM A COMPANY." Mrs Kirkpatrick Mav I be permitted to ex- plain more lucidly. At the present time the London & North-Western Railway Company are doing their level best to advertise Colwyn. Bay as a winter resort. If we want a winter resort to bring winter visitors and a winter income, we must have some attractions for those people, and somewhere for them to go when they come. At the present time we have not a mousehole— (laughter),—nothing but shelters and promen- ade. It is necessary to have winter gardens and everything that it necessary in the way of baths and so forth for the benefit of those people when they come. Because if we bring them here in the winter, and there is nothing for them, they will go 'away again. So I think it is better to have a permanent building than to spend £1,500 in putting up a pavilion for a week and then taking it down again as was done at Llangollen, and then selling it at the end of the week for [soa, or the debris of it. I say let us as townspeople and as taxpayers, men and women, form a company amongst our- selves and take Zi sihares. We could erect a building, costing, from £ 2,000 to 65,0o0, large enough for the Eisteddfod, which could be used for winter gardens and for large meetings, such as large united Sunday School gatherings, pol- itical meetings, and May Day gatherings, for which latter alone we would receive /40 for a week. And let us, build a nice building, and if neCffllsary enlarge and better it as we go on. At present you have this chance with the Eistedd- fod, which you may never have again. We have airived at the crisis in Colwyn Bay. We have a sufficient population;, and unless we do some- thing to meet their requirements we will allow our rivals to go ahead of us. Rhyl has a pavilion, and Llandudno are enlarging their pavilion. And are we to do nothing? We ought to consider the retired people who have come to live at Colwyn Bay. Scores of them have come to me and asked why there is no theatre or anything else for their amusement. If we do not move at once we shall have no site left. (Hear, hear.) Very shortly, if we want a site, we shall have to purchase the site and the build- ing standing upon it as well and pull down that building in order to put up OUT own. (Hear, hear.) That is why we are called here to-night. There should be £ 1 shares, and we should make a house to house visitation. I know a great many friends who will take shares, like my friend Mr. Dicken, over there. (Laughter and hear, hear.) If we build a pavilion the Eistedd- fod Committee will pay us money which other- wise would be thrown away. As to the question of site, that is for you to thrash it out for your- selves and say which is best from every -oint of view. The Chairman About the site. If a perma- nent building was built, we are not bound to take this site. A smaller site would do, because it would be possible to have galleries. A POSSIBLE CHANGE. Mr. H. V. Doughty-Dajvies (Secretary to the General Purposes Committee) Whilst we have decided upon Pendorlan site, it doesn't me for one moment that you cannot procure a site which will equal it. We may reconsider it, and I think there is a feeling that way. Mr. Ro- berts, the General Secretary, tells me there is a great deal of disappointment in the town re- garding that site. If you decide upon some other site I don't say our Committee won't ac- cept it. Mr. S. K. Williams asked what would be the price of a permanent pavilion. Mr. Doughty Davies: Between ^1,200 and 1,500 for a temporary one. The Chairman Three times that amount for a permanent one. Mr. Pryce T. Williams said that when the Ex- ecutive Committee met the previous, week, only the Pendorlan site was placed before them. by the General Purposes Committee. If it was now competent to suggest other suitable sites to the present meeting, he wooild be prepared to1 do so, but he did not wish to name them without the consent of the meeting. The Chairman We are not at an Eisteddfod Committee now. Mr. Roberts (Public Benefit Co.) Is this meeting called for the Eisteddfod Committee or for the ratepayers of Colwyn Bay? Mrs. Kirkpatrick For the benefit of all. Mr. Roberts: Who is. responsible for the suc- cess or failure of the Eisteddfod? Is it not the guarantors ? The Chairman Certainly. IN FAVOUR OF PENDORLAN. Mr. J. Kyffin Jones (Greenwich House) It was passed by the Executive Committee, bv a considerable majority, that the best site obtain- able was Pendorlan. (Hear, hear.) The sub- Committee formed to go into this matter con- sisted of Mr. J. Berth Jones, the Rev. Thomas Parry, and Mr. J. M. Porter. I think you will all agree that three better men we could not find in Colwyn Bay to go. and look for the bcsi. available site for the erection of a pavilion. These gentlemen came here with their report and said that after walking over 'Colwyn Bay time after time they could not fix upon anything bet- ter than that. The Committee decided to ac- cept their suggestion, and I think it is very un- kind towards tfhe General Purposes Committee that anyone, should endeavour to undo their woik. (Hear, hear.) I think they are men we can well trust. They have the interest of Col- wyn Bay at heart as much as any of us. I hope that we shall not allow what has been done by the General Purposes Committee and adopted by the Executive Committee to be undone. (Hear, hear.) Mr. E. R. Gibbons We are not here as an Eisteddfod Committee. It may be a good site for the Eisteddfod, but it may not be a good site for a permanent pavilion. Mr. S. K. Williams The question we are here to consider is the advisability of putting up a permanent building on the site of the Eistedd- fod .pavilion. The Committee have decided up- on that site, and the point is whether it is ad- visable and possible tOo put a permanent build- ing on that site. The Chairman I have explained before that if we make a permanent navilion we don't want such a large piece of land, because in a perma- nent paivilion we could make galleries. Mr. S. K. Williams But are we bound to buy all this land, or only what we require? Mr. Roberts Of course, we may buy it all and add winter gardens. Mrs. Kirkpatrick That is what the idea is for the future. Rev. W. Hughes In my circular 1 said no- thing about any site but Pendorlan. I am go- ing to be loyal to the Eisteddfod Committee. They may take from us Zi,oco if we go any- where else than fixed, and fixed by a thoroughly good majority, and we should not be like child- ren and try and undo what they have done. I have respect for the three gentle-men named. They are about the best judges in the town, and the General Purposes Committee adonted the recommendation, and only one was against, and he was in favour of Ty'nymaes field. They considered, it dry and most suitable in every way, and only three minutes from the station. The agitation is unworthy of Colwyn Bay to try to undo this, and it is for us to consider whether we are going in for a permanent pavilion there. If a temporary pavilion will do there, a perma- nent building will do better. You can buy that road, and make it better towards the town. I hope you will consider the site decided upon. You can have two acres of land, if you like, and sufficient to make winter gardens. It is near the shore, near the station, and in the heart of the population. I don't think there is a better place. It is a pleasant site, and you can build a terrace of houses there and still have your winter gardens, &c., rent free. You can build a high wall and plant trees, and your winter gardens will be there. Mr. J. Dicken We are not here to say which site. The: Committee has to see to that. The question is., permanent building and winter gar- den, or not. Is that so, Mrs. Kirkpatrick? Mrs. Kirkpatrick: Yes. Mr. Adamson If a company was formed, and if that company decided, not upon Pendorlan, but some other site, would the Eisteddfod Com- mittee give their patronage ? The Chairman I should' think they would, but I cannot be responsible for them. Mr. Adamson There is [1,200 at stake. The Chairman It is very likely they would. Rev. W. Hughes It is very unlikely they will have another site. Mrs. Kirkpatrick said that the Musical Com- mittee was opposed to the Pendorlan site. Mr. J. W. Adamson The point is whether the Eisteddfod Committee will patronise us if we take some other site than Pendtorlan. Mr. S. K. Williams: I maintain we are here to consider whether we will erect a pavilion on Pendorlan field. I maintain we are here, ac- cording to the circular, to consider that A Voice: A public meeting has power to do anything. Mr. S. K. Williams: Excuse me. The Com- mittee has chosen the site it is for us to say
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Scholastic. LAN A VON, Cadnant Park, Conway.—Girls y Boarding and Day School. Preparatory for boys under 10. Excellent care, diet and education. Fees moderate. Principal Miss Shaw. Languages and Music. 168 LONDON and Bangor Matriculation, Lampeter Civil Service Examiations. MR. W. BEZANT LOWE, M.A., F.C.S., hfs classes in Bangor and Conway; also private Tuition or Classes in Classics, Mathematics, Modern Languages, Natural Sciences in Bangor, Llandudno, Conway, Colwyn Bay, Abergele, &c. —Apply, Cae Carw, Llanfairfechan. ART & CRAFTS CLASSES MISS HOLMES Certificated Art Mistress, South Kensington; Exhibitor at the Principal Exhibitions in England and Wales; Instructress for the past 12 years to the Technical Art Classes, Colwyn Bay. RECEIVES Pupils for instruotio* in Draw- i»'R, Shading., Painting in Oils and Water Colours from Life, Models, Casts and Natursal Objects; Sketching from Nature, Modelling, Casting, Design, Embossed amid Cut Leather, Metal, Marqueterie, &c.. &c. Special arrangements for Private Lessons, Pupils at a distances, and for Visitors. LARKPIKLD, STUDIO: COLWYN BAY. PENRHYN ROAD, 47 HIGHER GRADE SCHOOL AND PUPIL TEACHERS' CENTRE, COLWYN BAY. HEAD MASTER E. GRIFFITHS, C.M. SCIENCE MASTER S. GLYNNE JONES, B.A., L.C.P. ASSISTANT MASTERS: J. HENRY ROBERTS, B.A. LL. WILLIAMS, B.A ASSISTANT MISTRESSES M. SNODDY, B.A. L. C. JONES, B A. S. PARRY. COOKERY MISTRESS: J. P. WILLIAMS (Diploma of Training Schoolef Cookery, Chester) THE School is pleasantly situated, has a large Assemo.y Hall, separate Classrooms, Science Laboratories, Workshop, and a large Kitchen well adapted for the teaching of Cookery and Laundry Work. The School also possesses extensive Recreation Grounds. Pupils must be twelve years of age on admission. The course of instruction provides preparation for London aad Welsh Matriculation; Oxford Local Examination (Pre- minary, Junior and Senior), Particulars of Fees on application to Head Master, or to Mr. F. J. Holmes, Bank Chambers, Colwvn Bav. 45 GIRLS' COLLEGE, 11 Gorphwysfa," Old Colwyn. Principal: Miss M. M. MELLOR. Assisted by an Efficient Staff of Resident English anci Foreign Govemesaea and Visiting Professors. Pupils are prepared for the Oxford & Cambridge Local and London Matriculation Examinations. The College, which ooiKtriftRds an extensive view stands within its own grounds of 1 acres. Spacious and Well Ventilated Glass Rooms, Tennis and Croquet Lawns. 46 Musical. EXPERT lUllluN by Correspondence in Theory of Music and Composition.—H. C. L. Stocks, F.R.C.O., Yeovil. 173°. ONWAY QUADfTlLLE BAND. — Violin, 'Cello, and Piano (augmented if necessary), Large Repertoire of all the latest dance music open to engagements for Balls, Private Dances, &c.—Terms apply, John H. Stott, 2, Oswald-road, Llandndno Junction. 1558 IANOFORTE, SINGING, HARMONY.-P. JT W. MATHERS, A.R.C.O. (formerly for i& years Organist and Choirmaster of Lymm Parish Church), Baycliffe," Seafield-road, Col- wyn Bay preparation for Examinations many past successes. Lessons at own or pupils' resid- ence. Terms moderate. 34IA Miss Maldwyn Price, I.S.M., R.A.M., Cert., Gives Lessons in VOICE PRODUCTION, SOLO SINGING, PIANO. Visits Llandudno and Conway. Terms on application to- A. J. FLEET, Music Warehouse, COLWYN BAY, AND OSBORNE HOUSE, Bay View Road, COLWYN BAY. 49 MR. F. GURNEY BARNETT. L.R.A.M., A.R.C.M., Teaching Singing, Teaching Pianoforte, (Former pupil in London of R. J. PITCHER, Esq. Mus. B., F.R.C.O., &c., Professor at the Guildhall School of Music). CONDUCTOR of the Colwyn Bay Philharmonic Society, and Colwyn Bay Ladies' Choir. LESSONS GIVEN IN VOICE PRODUCTION, SOLO SINGING, PIANOFORTE AND ORGAN PLAYING, HARMONY, COUNTERPOINT, ETC. Candidates prepared for all recognised exam- inations and competitions. ADDRESS: NORMANHURST, LLANERCH-ROAD, COLWYN BAY. 48
IThe Need for Winter Gardens.…
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whether we will have a permanent building or I a temporary one. The Chairman Do you propose that? Mrs. Kirkpatrick: Tihe Musical Committee I say they won't adjudicate there. Captain Thomas Roberts: 1 can't see that we want to go and squabble about it. The Eistedd- fod Committee has passed what site is to be adopted, and I beg to move that we now take the voice of the meeting as to the best way to go on with putting a building there. The Eis- teddfodl Committee is willing to pay us the money. Let us decide whether we go in for a permanent building on Pendorlan field. PROBABLE COST. Mr. Adamison It seems to me that we are now acquiesing in what the Eisteddfod Com- mittee has done. Then form a committee to see the thing through. There is money to. be got. What is the good' of this money. Proceeding, the speaker was understood to complain that there were no estimates before the Committee of the probable cost of the land and structure, which he suggested would amount to £ 6,000 or 7,000. The Chairman replied that it was impossible to spend money on. plans and estimates before it had been decided to form a company. The time was very short in which to prepare these things. THE DEMAND FOR BATHS. Councillor Samuel Jones I hesitate to speak, because it is a very important matter for Col- wyn Bay. I consider that one of the most press- ing needs of Colwyn Ba" at the nreserlt time is something in the form of winter gardens, music- al pavilion, baths, hydro (if you like, though that may be left out for the present), and skat- ing rink. A skating rink may be all very well at the present time But we must remember that Colwyn Bay is growing, and m more than one direction. At the same time, in my humble opinion, what we need is not a building that would (be suitable for the Eisteddfod to hold its meetings in. I question very much the pro- priety of putting up a building that will hold fihie Eisteddfod. In the first place, it would be too large. In the second, it would be unsuitable ,to meet the requirements of Colwyn: Bay )in years to come. A small building, well filled and well patronised, i- better than a large burld- ing ,half full. In the one case, the small build- ing well filled, you get a feeling of contentment, you get sufficient revenue to meet expenditure, and, if yoli 'secure all the land required, you can extend the building at any time to meet the requirements of a growing place like Colwyn Bay. That question of site is a big one. My interests are in the Pendorlan end, but I hesitate to say that that is the best place. We want a good; class of visitors, who, would come here if we had a first-class hydro and baths. Scores of people go away because there are no baths. Hundreds more would stay longer if we had winter gardens and biatihs. I may be wrong, but I think the Pendorlan site is the wrong place for the Eisteddfod. I have in my mind a place eminently suitable for this, though I am not sure whether the price is prohibitive, but we ^hall find unless such a site is acquired soon it will have to be acquired later on at great ex- pense. The one in my mind is on the westerly side of Penrhos 'College, facing the sea. I may be wrong, but it is in my opinion the best place for baths and winter gardens. You could put up a small yet commodious building and you could add to it as time goes on. Those are my views on the matter. I may be wrong, but PC] son ally I don't agree with a permanent building to accommodate the Eisteddfod, be- cause I think it would be too expensive, too large, and unfit for the future use of Colwyn Bay. (Hear, hear.) Mr. S. K. Williams don't quite understand Mr. Jones. (Laughter.) It is a very sensible speech about baths and a small theatre, and so on, but I maintain we are here to consider if an Eisteddfod, pavilion is practicable or not. I quite agree that a small theatre is very good, but that won't do for the Eisteddfod, I take it. I quite agree as to amusements and all that sort of thing, but is it any good for the Eisteddfod? Mr. Simon Williams (The Compton) I notice there is a feeling existing as regards the readi- ness which which the ratepayers generally will take up this matter. May I ask who have al- ready expressed their readiness to take shares? We seem to be in doubt as to how much would be taken. Has anyone said he will take shares if it is supported ? Councillor Samuel Jones I have heard that there are conditions respecting the Pendorlan land, which would practically make it impos- sible for the Eisteddfod Committee to accept it. and that there is a letter in existence which con- tains conditions which it will be practically im- possible for the Committee to accept. Rev. W. Hughes If we buy the land there will be no conditions as Mr. Jones refers to now. It is bought then. Of course, you won't get the town unanimous for anything. If you choose another site you will get as many, if not more, against it. We were 22 to 13 the night we voted, and we had more at the Committee than usual. I think there is a feeling in favour of Bryn Euryn, but if. you put a permanent build- ing there you don't -et more (than a dozen shareholders. Put it in the heart of the town, and you will get nearly every tradesman to take shares. I am sure the feeling is very much in favour of a permanent pavilion, and if we at- tempt to upset what has been done you will get us one against another and you will never get a permanent pavilion.. It is better for us to b- loyal and; stick to the place where you can get £ 1,000. Mention has been made of the Music Committee. They should have said that before. A fair vote was taken, and it was car- ned. Surely, we are not going in for undoing their work. If you do it will collapse. You won't get anything done. If you say we will do it, it will be done. If you buy the land the man will sell it and will give 30 to 40 per cent. to- wards the purchase price. That is something— almost half of it. POSSIBLE SHAREHOLDERS. Mr. J. Kyffin Jones: As one who took a lead- ing part in canvassing the town for guarantors, I can say that several asked myself and Mr. Allen" Is it not possible to get s. permanent building? I would be quite agreeable to leave my £ 5 guarantee money in as my share in the permanent pavilion." There are some of those gentlemen present in this meeting now, and I can give you my tword that several spoke to Mr. Allen and myself in that strain. The Chairman I don't know exactly how to (go on best, because if you put it to the vote, is it fair for those who won't take shares to be allowed to vote? I don't think that would be fair. Mr. C. R. Chaplin remarked that the Eistedd- fod pavilion would take up the whole of the ground available at Pendorlan, and that they could not put a winter warden inside the Pavil- ion. (Laughter.) He described the large pavil- ion at Carnarvon as a white elephant." Mrs. Kirkpatrick At Blackpool the winter gardens, of five acres are under covet. Mr. Chaplin Yes, that's a different place, and we don't get people like they do. Mrs. Kirkpatrick That's just what we want to do, to get the people iheie. (Laughter and applause.) Mr. Chaplin said that Colwyn Bay already had one pavilion, which was closed practically half the year, and the town did not want another. Mrs. Kirkpatrick, replying to further remarks by Mr. Chaplin, said that what was required was a building sufficiently large for all pur- poses, which could be adapted to the other iqjrts of the scheme. Mr. S. K. Williams I think we are wandering from the subject. (Laughter.) I ae-ree with Mrs Kirkpatrick, but that is not before the meeting to-nisht. We are here to consider whether it is possible to have a permanent building instead of a temporary one for the Eisteddfod. While we require all these things, that is not before the meeting to-night. We are out of order in discussing anything but that. EAST v. WEST." Mr Hugh Owen (Oxford House: I fear there is a spirit of east v. west. The best way would be to get a vote of the whole town. We should issue a card to all the townspeople asking them to vote on three points-Whether they are in d:i3;Vour of a permanent pavilion,, whether they wiilll take shares, and which they consider the best site. It would be easy to "t a post-card vote of the whole town. We are all ratepayers, but this meeting represents but a small fraction of the whole; of the ratepayers. Mr. S. K. Williams: Do you suggest that everyone should vote, or only those who will take !shares? Mr. Owen 1 would put that question on the paper. Mr. S. K. Williams But which are you go- ing to count? Mr. Owen: I wo.uld count them all. Mr. S. K. Williams Then I would disagree .vith you. Mr. Sjhofield What do you mean by a per- manent building? Do you mean a £ 60,000 job? And could the plans "De passed before next October? (Laughter.) The Chairman Is it advisable to have a per- manent building? Let's have a vote on that to start. Mr. Roberts (Public Benefit) But is to be on this particular site? Mr. S. K. Williams: We are here to consider that site, and that one alone. Mr. Adamson It seems to. me we have one pavihon in the town now; it is no use having another unless we take it for winter gardens. Captain Roberts That is what I proposed at firstt. To stop Ithis bother, vote whether we have it or not. There is one pavilion, but we want winter gardens. I want_to, have the voice of this meeting without further talk, is it ad- visable to have a permanent building or not on that site. Mr. Schofield seconded. Mr. Tucker If a permanent building is re- quired in Colwyn Bay, you wont have time to do it before the 1st August. Mr S. K. Williams That. is what we are called for to-night. We are called for nothing Mr Tucker My opinion is that you are talk- ing about big things which cannot be ready by August 1 st. I believe in winter gardens, and would join anyone with a reasonable prospect of success in going in for these things, but we cannot rush them through by the time required for the Eisteddfod. Undoubtedly, as Mrs Kirk- patrick has said, we want winter gardens and we want baths to, keep our town, up-to-date, but as the pavilion is wanted by August, there is not time to do it. Rev. W. Hughes Those of us who- have been talking the matter over are of opinion that a steel pavilion would be most useful—a steel building like the skating rinks,so there is ample time. It is not necessary to have a bi? stone or brick structure. You can make half of it a skatin)g rink and half of it for something else, and remove the partition when there is a bii? political meeting addJressed by Mr Lloyd George or Mr Balfour. We should then have more of such meetings at Colwyn Bav. and the business people of Colwyn Bay would do a good share of business. We don't want to make money out of it, only the interest, say four per oent. With such a pavilion, you will get a second Eisteddfod much quicker. Mr Hughes (Apollo) It would be useless erecting a permanent building o hold 10,000 people. Mr Prvce T. Williams: The question is whether Pendorlan would be the place for a per- manent building. That is the answer we want in this meeting. The Chairman I don't think that affects us. Mr Pryce Williams: I take it we are bound in honour to stick to that committee, or we may be accused of acting disrespectfully towards the committee. I have the greatest respect for all the members of that committee. I had been given to understand that there was a feeling in the town for a permanent building, and my ob- ject in the Executive Committee was to point out that such a feeling was said to' exist, and to ask whether we could have a central site. The Executive Committee decidied that Pendor- lan was the proper place and the question now is whether Pendorlan is the proper place for the permanent building. Mr S. Johnston (sfpeaking amid interruption) I am glad Mr Williams put it so clearly. My interests are in that oart, but I feel that Pen- dorlan is notal suitable place for a permanent building, especially if we are to. have baths. &c., since: people who go to baths would not reside in the locality, Greenfield-road and the adioin- inig roads. (" Question," and a voice You have only been here a month f') I am speak- in7 out my mind. It is. all an open question. Mrs Kirkpafricik: You must all admit that when Colwyn Bay was first constructed—(inter- ruption) Mr S. K. Williams row. to a point of order amidist cries of Go on, Johnston." Mr Johnston I am very glad I have aroused some opposition. It is then you get to definite, tangible, results. What we have to think of is not",as: to how the Eisteddfod alone will benefit, but how the town itself will benefit. We are here as a meeting of ratepayers, and we have the welfare and prosioeritv of Colwyn Bay to consider. I repeat that Pendbrlan is not the site for a permanent pavilion, esroecially for the purpose of winter gardens. The hall at Carnar- von looks like a barn., which is no recommenda- tion. We want buildings that will attract and make people believe that Colwyn Bay is a desir- able place. We don't follow Blackpool, whiov attracts a mixed class. But I think we can go one better and get a more central position. In the course of further discussion, Mrs Kirk- patrick argued in favour of findini"- a site in the west end, which would be free from raihvay noises. The Eisteddfod Committee, if Pendor- lan was adonted, would Ifind the trains would be very objectionable. It was the same with the Victoria Pavilion and the Pierrots. If, said the speaker, it is decided to have a town scheme, we want to have a place which will be good for the Eisteddfod. Mr Lloyd (Pendorlan) What about Old Col- wyn? (Laughter, and cheers and cries of "West end.") .Mr Roberts: Where do the bulk of the guar- antors come from? Mr S. K. Williams We are not here to dis- cuss guarantors or anything else. Unless we are here to discuss whether the building on Pen- dorlan is to be a premanent or a temporary one, we may as well go home. While I agree as to the necessity for winter gardens, that question is not before us to-night. There was some discussion as to what was the actual subject; to be voted upon, and xhe Rev. W. Hughes said Leave the site alone. Say whether you are in favour of a permanent build- ing or not. Mr Simon Williams: Does it folliow that everyone who votes in> favour is pledged to take shares ? Rev. W. Hushes No Mr S. K. Williams That is unfair. We arc, here to-night to vote whether it is a permanent or temporary building at Pendorlan. Captain Roberts: That was mv proposition. We here to-night have nothing to do with a tem- porary pavilion. It is the Eisteddfod 'Com- mittee that have to decide that. What we have to do here to-night is to say wheher we build a permanent building on PendoTlan. No. talk about any other site. You can't go into that, because we have been called here for a specific thing, and that is Pendorlan. Mr J. R. Jones (Lancaster House) proposed that they name a committee of twelve to can- vass the town as to whether; the public would have a permanent building for the purpose. Mr Schofield We have been called; Mr S. K. Williams If the question of share- holders ———— Rev. W. Hughes You have been called to say I whether you want a permanent building for the Eisteddfod or not. A division was taken, and the Chairman reckon,ed 312 for and 24 aigainst the proposition, which was declared carried. Rev. W. Hughes hoped thev would all be loyal to the majority. Mrs Kirkpatrick (with an air of disigust): I won't put a penny in Pendorlan. It is useless to me, useless to all of us. (Laughter.) Mr S. K. Willi,amis (smilingly tapping his chest) Not useless to me, Mrs Kirkpatrick. (Re- newed laughter.) The following committee of twenty was se- lected to prepare a scheme: -M,essrs S. K. Wil- liams, J. Berth Jones, Councillor T. R. Dav- ies, G. MadeU, Pryce T. Williams, Rev. W. Hughes, Councillor George Bevan, Simon Wil- liams, J. Kyffin Jones, John Jones (Grimsby House), J. M. Porter, Jarnesi Arundale, John Williams (Station-road), Henry Morris (Free- lands), Owen Lloyd (Pendorlan), Councillor Dicken, Councillor D. O. Williams, Mr Davies (Glani Conway Villa), Councillor Hoskins (Col- wyn). The Rev. W. Hughes to act as convener. A PROTEST. Councillor Samuel Jones: Mr Hughes has several times referred to "disloyalty" to the. Eisteddfod Committee. I object, I absolutely and strongly object., to that because no one has come here in a spirit of hostility to the Com- mittee. I have come here to consider the ques- tion of what is best for Colwyn Bay, and have spokefn, my mind freely. Rev. W. Hughes You misunderstand me. I say an agitation in the town people have op- posed the/ thing that has been done. That is disloyal. Thanks were accorded the Chairman, on the motion of the Rev. Thomas Parry, J.P., seconded by Mr Owen Lloyd.