The North Wales Times

POLICE COURT. Monday, before Chancellor Bulkeley Jones (in the chair), The Lord Lieutenant (Col. Corn- wallis West), The Mayor of Ruthin (Dr. J. M. Hughes), Mr. J. Watkin Lumley, and Mr. W. T. Rouw. THE REMITTANCE OF COURT FEES. Inspector Thomas (Denbigh), of the N.S.P.C.C. appeared to apply for the remit- tance of the court fees in a case in which he secured a conviction against a man named Ishmael Roberts for cruelty to his children, Roberts being now in prison. Replying to the justices, the Inspector said the society was maintained by voluntary con- tributions, and that it was now the custom in many courts throughout the country to remit the court fees in cases of this nature. Col. West said that the society was doing admirable work, and deserved all assistance and sympathy. The bench granted the application. THE NEW CLERK RETURNING THANKS. The Chairman said he had received a letter from Mr. Fanning, Amlwch, thanking him (the chairman) for his kindness, and requesting him to convey his thanks also to his brother justices for electing him as clerk of the Ruthin Justices. To be clerk to the Ruthin justices was indeed an honour, which was rendered greater by the circumstances under which he was appointed. It would be his endeavour to satisfy the bench. THE RECENT APPOINTMENT OF JUSTICES' CLERK. MR. LUMLEY AND THE LORD LIEUTENANT. The Acting clerk (Mr. John Roberts) having obtained the permission of the bench to make a personal explanation, referred to the corres- pondence which had been published in the 'Free Press'last week, by the Lord Lieuten- ant, with reference to the appointment of magistrates' clerk. In that letter the Lord Lieutenant stated that he doubted the opinion given by him (the acting clerk) as Deputy Clerk of the Peace, with reference to the mode of procedure for the election of clerk, ques- tioning the necessity and expediency of making the election publicly in Petty Sessions. In justice to himself, he thought it was only right for him to say that his opinion on that ques tion was never asked, and never given. The only opinion he was asked to give, -was as to the validity of the election by ballot. The Chairman I must remind you Mr. Ro- berts. It is true your opinion was not asked in court, but I had privately asked you whether the election should be in open court, or whether the justices might retire. You gave me your opinion then, that the election ought to take place in open court, because the Act of Parlia- ment says that the election shall take place in special sessions. You gave that as your opinion. The Acting Clerk No sir, you roust have misunderstood me. I had a conversation with you on Saturday preceding the election. You introduced the subject and reminded me that it was absolutely necessary for us to be cautions as to how the election was conducted, and I reminded you, that under the provisions of the Justices Clerks Act of 1877 that the election must take place in special sessions Then you sir, said, 'of course it must be in open court.' The Chairman It is rather a distinction than a difference. We don't differ very much. The Clerk The way the letter appears in the press has a tendency to reflect upon me. I did not express the opinion. Mr. Lumley I think it scarcely fair that the communication sent by the Lord Lieutenant, in the first instance should not appear in the press along with the answer given by Mr. Pember. We all know that Counsel will give an opinion upon questions or matter in the way in which it is asked. At present it is entirely a one-sided case. The public are asked to accept the opinion of a very eminent coun- sel, but it is all one sided, so far as the inter- ests of the public are concerned. It is an ex-parte statement, and I should like the Lord Lieutenant, if he be so good, to give to the public the same benefit as he has given them by pub'ishing the opinion of Mr Pember, by pub- lishing also the communication he sent to Mr. Pember. This matter arose from my asking a question in court here, as to whether it would be illegal if the appointment should be made in camera, but you, sir, as chairman of the court evidently were of the same opinion as myself, for you at once said, 'the doors will not be closed. It will be an open court.' There was no further opinion given by the clerk, and I scarcely think it fair towards the clerk that the Lord Lieutenant should say that the Deputy Clerk of the Peace should have said it was legal when he did not say so. I respectfully ask the Lord Lieutenant now, to give to the public the benefit of the communication he sent to Mr. Pember Lord Lieutenant I have nothing to say. This is not a place to discuss this matter at all. Mr. Lumley I don't wish you to discuss it any further. I am merely making a comment upon it. The Chairman: What has been done, has been rightly done. Mr. Lumley But there was no necessity of publishing the letter at all. Moreover, there is one word in the letter to which I take excep- tion. The Lord Lieutenant says that to ap- point a clerk publicly might lead to a mi8 chievous precedent.' I don't know what the mischievous precedent' can be. The Chairman said it appeared to him that the expression that the election must take place at a special session, which sessions were always held in open courts at Ruthin, implied to him that the election should take place in open court. Mr. Pember however, seemed to be of a different opinion, and their own Chair- man of Quarter Sessions agreed with him. Howevet the whole matter was now ended. This closed the incident. A PUBLICAN DRUNK ON HIS OWN LICENSED PREMISES. Goodman Humphreys, licensee of the Swan Inn, Well street, Ruthin, was summoned for being drunk at his own house on the 18th ult. Defendant for whom Mr. Edward Roberts, solicitor appeared, pleaded not guilty. This case was heard by Mr. Lumley alone, the other magistrates viz:—The Warden, Lord Lieutenant, The Mayor, and Mr. Rouw, retir- tog ixov& the bench on account of their being ng trustees to the Ruthin Charities to which the house in question belonged. P.P. William Jones, Llanfair, stated in evidence, that on Saturday evening the 18th of last month, he was on duty in Ruthin. About 10 30 p.m. he was down in Well street, and his attention was called towards the Swan, and he saw a crowd standing opposite the door, the same being mostly composed of women. He went into the Swan, and in the kitchen he found a man named Llewelyn Rowlands and his wife, with another man named Williams. Mrs. Llewelyn Rowlands was a sister to the landlord, and she was in the act of putting back her hair when he went in. There were a num- ber of empty glasses on the table, and the beer was running from the table on the kitchen floor. Llewelyn Rowlands had some cuts on his hand, which was bleeding. Rowlands made a state- ment to witness, and he saw the young woman who assisted in the bar, asking her to fetch the landlord. Humphreys then came from the kitchen on the other side of the bar. He was in his shirt sleeves, and was in the act of wip- ing his face with a toweL He was drunk and came to witness in the passage. Witness called his attention to the condition of the kitchen, and Humphreys said 'It has been a little family row, between me and my brother- in-law. It's all right now, thank you.' Witness asked him to come to the light in the kitchen, but he refused. Defendant could scarcely speak, and witness found he was drunk. Wit- ness got hold of his arm, with the intention of taking him to the light, but he refused, and pushed witness out into the street. At 11 o'clock, witness was again standing opposite the Swan. Customers were coming out of the house, and he saw the defendant, who was in a drunken state. He reported the case to Superintendent Jones, who ordered a prosecu- tion. Replying to Mr. Lumley, Sergeant Woollam said that a subpoena had been taken out against Llewelyn Rowlands, to come as a wit- ness, but the latter could not be found, and the same had not been therefore served. Cross-examined by Mr. Edward Roberts, witness said that defendant was staggering in the passage. This being all the evidence for the prosecu- tion, Mr. Edward Roberts addressed the court for the defence, saying that the defendant had been subjected to annoyances for a considerable time by his brother in-law and sister, who came to the house continually to borrow money and to make disturbances. Defendant was a respectable man, and when the police officer alleged that he was drunk, defendant was busy serving his customers. However, Llewelyn Rowlands and his wife became very offensive, and Humphreys took hold of one or both of them for the purpose of turning them out.. The women shouted and created a disturbance, and the defendant was undoubtedly greatly lagita- ted. The police constable was no doubt told that there was a row in the house, and formed the conclusion that somebody must be in drink. He found Humphreys on coming in, in an exited state, and from that concluded that he was under the influence of drink. The sug- gestion now was, that the date upon which the alleged offence took place and the date when the information was taken out indicated that the prosecution of this man was an afterthought. Humphreys had not been drinking on that day, and through the evening was in the house serving his customers. Should the bench con- vict the man, it would be a very serious matter indeed for him, and the probabitity was that he would be turned out of the house neck and crop; and besides that, a conviction would endanger the property itself, As a matter of fact, hundreds of pounds had been lost as the result of paltry cases of this kind. Mr. Lumley, interposing, said the court need scarcely go into that matter. Mr. Edward Roberts said he was merely pointing out that the evidence adduced for the prosecution should be supported to the hilt before his worship decided to convict. There was only one man, viz., the police constable himself, who said that Humphreys was drunk, but he would call several witnesses to prove that he was not drunk. Mr. Lumley recalled the police constable, and asked for his memorandum book, which he examined very carefully, handing the same also to Mr. Edward Roberts. Defendant was then put in the box, and on oath corroborated generally the statement made by his advocate. He said he had suffered considerable annoyance from Llewelyn Row- lands as to lending money, and had alterca- tions with him. It was very busy in the house on Saturday, and he himself practically did all the work of serving the customers. On that night his sister asked him for the loan of six. pence. Her husband and himself got into words, and had a bit of quarrel, which, how- ever, was only a family quarrel. It did not last for more tnan two minutes and nobody else interfered. He turned his sister out. He was very much excited and the police constable came in just at the time. He had a glass or two during the day. He drank about four in a day, and on Saturday drank no more than usual. There was no truth whatever in the suggestion that he was under the influence of drink. He served the customers, and then closed the door at 11 o'clock. Cross examined by the officer: Defendant said he did not bite the hands of Llewelyn Rowlands. He did not see the hand bleeding at all on Saturday, but saw it on Monday when he saw a scratch on it. The Officer: How do you account for that scratch ? Defendant: One of his fingers must have got between my teeth. How many beers had you that day? Two glasses of beer. Do you drink whiskey? Yes, occasionally. Did you do so that night? No. Not after 10 30 p.m ? Perhaps I got one in the excitement. Did you see me after that ? Yes, about II o'clock. And did I not say that if you could not look after yourself, you were not a fit and proper person to look after the house ? No. I don't think you did. Re-examined by Mr. Edward Roberts Def- endant said he never went near the officer, and never put his hand upon him at all. Mr. Lumley How many drinks do you take in a day ? Defendant four glasses of beer I generally take. You don't answer my question. How many drinks do you take in a day? I cannot recall it now, sir. Take last Saturday, how many drinks did y, have ? 1 "'ttake more than four or five. I am hot in IIA, habit of taking much drink. And ,,i swear this? Yes.I.V. Ann Jou. < was the next witness called. She said she wan 18 years of age, and was a servant at the Swan There was a quarrel between Humphreys an Llewelyn Rowlands on the night in question Humphreys was sober. She would not say but that he had taken a glass or two, but he was going about his work as usual, and served his customers until 11 o'clock. Cross-examined by the Officer: She said she did not serve her master with any liquor that night. Mr. Lumley Are you prepared to swear that Goodman Humphreys was sober that night ? Witness I don't say but that he had a glass or two. No, no, answer my question: Are you pre- pared to swear that Humphreys was sober that night? He was good- You answer my question. I don't want any explanation. Are you prepared to swear that Humphreys was sober that night? Witness here hesitated for some time, whereupon, Mr. Lumley said, why don't you answer the question. Was he sober or drunk? Witness He was not quite sober, sir, but he was not drunk. Harriet Williams, Railway Terrace, Harriet Jones,Llanrhydd at Jane Williams, Llanrhydd St., also gave evidence to the effect that they visited the house about 10 30 to 11 o'clock on the night of the quarrel, and swore that Humphreys was not drunk. Mr. Edward Roberts who had had an inter- view with the first witness Anne Jones, asked permission to recall her. Mr. Lumley: 1 don't think it's right tor you to call her after having interviewed her Mr. Edward Roberts; Very well, sir. Mr. Lumley: I can only come to one con- clusion. The police have no witnesses, but a witness that has bean called for the defence has admitted that the defendant was not sober. Therefore, lean come to no other conclusion, but that the defendant was drunk. He will be fined 5s. and costs.

SCHOOL BOARD. The monthly meeting of the Ruthin School Board was held in the Mayor's Parlour, adjoin- ing the Council Chambers on Friday evening, when the members present were:—Mr. Theodore J. Rouw (Chairman), Mr. Francis Dowell (Vice- chairman), the Rev. Isaac James, Messrs. R. Harris Jones, and T. M. Gee, Mr. Ezra Ro- berts (Clerk), Mr. Williams (Headmaster), and Mr. Phillips (School Attendance Officer). THE ATTENDANCE OF MEMBERS. As instructed at the last meeting, the Clerk had prepared a return showing the attendances made by members of the Board during the past three years. The number possible in each case was 39, and the actual attendances were Mr. Francis Dowell, 23 the Rev. Isaac James, 27; Mr. David Jones, 21 Mr. J. W. Lumley, 18; the Rev. J. F. Reece, 8; Mr. T. H. Ro berts, 19; ancl Mr. T. J. Rouw, 31. The Chairman said the comments made at the meeting were not only upon the attendance at the meetings of the Board, but upon the visit ing of the schools. The work of the Board was not altogether done at meetings of that kind-a good deal of work could be done by members paying more attention to the visiting of the school. The Rev. Isaac James: We generally appoint two members to act as visitors. The Chairman We appoint two as visitors, but I don't think that debars any other member from visiting the schools. The appointment of school visitors is really in case of any matter of urgency cropping up. I am strongly against the appointment of two as visitors, because my experience has been that the two appointed seldom turn up, and if you go through the log- book for the last three years you will find that most of the members have hardly ever put foot in the schools. THE ATTENDANCE OF CHILDREN. The monthly report showed that the number of scholars on the register of the Board School was 198, and the average attendance for the four weeks ending February 24th was 127'3 infants, 74; average attendance, 42.8. National School, 260 on the register; average, 1182; Clocaenog School, 6 average, 4 2 percentage in Board School (higher department), 67 in- fanta, 62; National School, 70; Clocaenog, 73; increase in Board School, 1'2 (higher depart ment); infants, -l'I. The Chairman considered this was not at all satisfactory. They should have at least an at- tendance of 80 per cent. Mr. Dowell called attention to the fact that the attendance at the National School was more than at the Board School, and it had been 80 for years. The Clerk said they would never be able to satisfactorily guage their attendance until they had a more effective return than they had at present. They should have what was called a duplicate register, in which the name of every child should be entered, so that they conld trace the attendance of any child for any period they liked. He would suggest also the advisa- bility of having a sort of prize scheme for at- tendance. It might, too, be a. good plan to get out a circular to parents asking them to make every effort to send their children regularly to school, pointing out that irregular attendance meant a direct loss to the ratepayers. The Chairman said he quite agreed that com- pulsion should be the last thing they should re- sort to. He was strongly in favour of offering onaall,prizes for attendance. It would pay them in the long run, for not only would they get a better attendance, but as a result they would secure a high grant. The best idea would be, as the Clerk suggested, to issue a circular to the ratepayers of Ruthin pointing out not only the loss to themselves, but to the children also in not being half educated. The Attendance Officer should take a note of those children who stayed away from school for the purpose of going to work, for he did not think it was well understood that they could take proceedings against persons who employed children who ought to be at school, and that they were sub- ject to a fine of 40s. It should be an instruction from the meeting that the Attendance Officer be asked to submit a list cf such children, And then the Board could decide what steps to take. The Rev. Isaac James said there was another class whom they should look after, he meant those who were too poor to clothe their child- ren properly, and, therefore, did not care to send them to school. The Chairman said he was afraid it was often the case that people had quite sufficient money to clothe their children properly, but would not do it, preferring to spend their money in other ways. The Clerk pointed out that regular attend. ance under the byelaws meant attendance at school every time the school was opened unless reasonable excuse could be given. Reasonable excuse generally meant illness. Of course, there was a discretion resting with the magis trates, but it had always been held that poverty was not a reasonable excuse, now that the parents did not have to pay school fees. The Rev. 1. James: But if a poor child has no clothes, surely that must be a reasonable ex. cuse. The Chairman I don't think we can resolve ourselves into a kind of clothing club (laugh- ter). I don't believe there is a case in Ruthin where a child is neglected, where the neglect was not dne to both or one or other of the parents. I think it should be an instruction to the Attendance Officer to use a little more energy if possible. Why should not the at- tendance at the Board School be equal to that at the National School ? I hope that during the next month the attendance will be increased to 75 per cent. in the Board School, and that at the end of that time the Attendance Officer will provide the list we have asked him for, of those who are employed who should not be. It was eventually decided to leave the mat- ter in the hands of Messrs. Dowell and Gee who bad been appointed to go through the ab- sentee lists. APPOINTMENT OF SCHOOL VISITORS. With regard to the appointment of school visitors, the Chairman said he considered the whole Board should act as school visitors, and that they should go to the schools as often as possible. In answer to a question, the schoolmaster said the attendance of members had been a very considerable help in the past. It was decided to adopt the Chairman's sug- gestion. THE CHAIRMAN AND THE SCHOOL- MASTER. The Chairman asked Mr. Williams, the head- master, when he submitted his time table to the Government Inspector. Mr. Williams replied that he did so whenever he felt it was necessary to make a change in the table. If he thought it was workable it might remain in force for two or three years. The Chairman thought it would be well if the Board considered the time table at one of their meetings, and asked Mr. Williams what grant they were earning. Mr. Williams replied that the grant obtained was about 1:1 per head, and the Clerk stated the amount was 18s. per head on average at- tendance and an additional £10 which would make it about 19s. 8d. The Chairman said he found there were schools in the neighbourhood who weie earning a very much higher grant. Mr. Williams: Will you name them, Mr. Rouw ? The Chairman said he could not do so at the moment, but he knew it was so. t Mr. Williams considered it was not right for Mr. Rouw to make such a statement without supporting it. He took it as a reflection upon the efficiency of the staff. Mr. Rouw No, sir, I did not intend any- thing of the kind. Mr. Williams Well that was certainly how it appeared to me. We are certainly earning as much as we can. It was decided that the question should be put down for discussion at the next meeting of the Board. THE ESTIMATES. The Clerk submitted the estimates for in- come and expenditure of the Board as follows: —Sum required for administration expenses, f50 10s. lid.; expenses of maintenance, 9461 12s. 6d.; payment in respect of loans, 933; payment to Clocaenog School Board, £ 7 2s.— total, 9553 5s. 5d. The receipts would, pro- bably, be:—The annual grant, 9184 18s. 8d. (based on average of years); drawing grant, 912 4s. lOd.; fee grant, f,98 Os. lOd. balance in hand, 914 6s. 7d.-total, 9310 Os. lid. This left a deiciency of E242 4s. 6d. to be appor- tioned as follows :—Ruthin borough, £ 181; Llanfwrog rural, £ 41 (less £ 22 portion of grant under Agricultural Rates Act); Llanrhydd rural, 920 (less Ell); amount to be received direct from Government on behalf of these two parishes under the Agricultural Rates Act, £33, making a total of £242, The Chairman What amount of rate does that work out at? The Clerk: The rate in the borough calcu- lating upon the total rateable value would be about 41d., but owing to the fact that only one- fourth is paid by land and only one-half by cottage property, it will represent a rate of 5id. The Chairman This, of course, will be an increase on the rate last year. The Clerk Yes, it was 5d. last year. There is one item which will account for almost the whole of the increase-you have increased the salary of the assistant master from jE50 to JE80. The Chairman We have to face this fact- that we shall require a bigger rate. The Clerk said there were several matters which ought to be gone into by the Board which were not provided for in the estimates. If they took these things intc consideration it would be well to go in for a loan which would only cause a small additional expenditure per annum. The Chairman said he most certainly thought they should go in for a loan if they were going to carry out the heating of the school, which was at present in a most unsatisfactory condi- tion. Then, as the Inspector had pointed out, it was absolutely necessary something should be done for the playground, and that would, probably, mean an expenditure of £100. It was decided that the estimates be accepted and that a precept be signed for the amount stated. THE SCHOLARSHIPS' EXAMINATION. The Clerk read a letter from the Local Governing Body of the Ruthin County School, saying it was intended to hold an examination for scholarships on March 25th, and as the alterations to the school premises would not be completed until after that date, they asked the Board's permission to hold the examination in the Board School. The application w.is granted. In answer to a question, Mr.Williams said he expected he would have a few pupils in for the examination.

TOWN COUNCIL. A meeting of the Council was held on Mon- day. The Mayor (Dr. J. M. Hughes) presided, and there were present, Aldermen R. P. Davies, Edward Roberts, Councillors John Roberts, T. J. Rouw, Francis Dowell, E. T. Hughes, Joseph Davies, T. H. Roberts. E. Tegid Owen, G. F. By ford, with the Town Clerk (Mr. W. Lloyd), the deputy town clerk (Mr. Baldwin Griffihs), and the borough surveyor (Mr. Price Morris). PROPOSED ALTERATION OF THE MARKET HALL. A report of the Market Hall Committee, held on the 13th of February, was submitted. The report contained the following resolution, that no scheme for the conversion of the Market Hall will be acceptable that will not include the following- Gymnasium, reading room, library, baths, and class rooms. Resolved also that the Committee consult Mr. James Hughes, architect, Denbigh, upon the matter of the conversion of the hall, and that the question of his fee be arranged by the chair- man of the Committee (Mr. Ezra Roberts)' At a further meeting of the Committee, held March the 1st, Mr. James Hughes was present, and it was resolved that it be an instruction to the Committee to prepare alternative pro- posals, together with estimates of the costs of the conversion of the Market hall, and the provision of a library, reading rooms, and classrooms.' Mr. Edward Roberts said that at the first meeting of the Committee, it was thought that no scheme would be acceptable which did not include a gymnasium. At a subsequent meeting some of the members thought that for the pre- sent the gymnasium should be put on one side, and so it was decided. He proposed the adop tion of the two reports as they stood, and that for the present, that the gymnasium question should stand over. Mr. Rouw seconded. At the suggestion of Mr. John Roberts, how. ever, Mr. Roberts withdrew his motion, and the question was adjourned until the Committee can report further upon it. BYELAWS. At a Committee of the Byelaws Committee, held on the 17th of February, it was resolved that the Town Clerk be requested to condense model Byelaw No. 3, relating to Common Lodging Houses, so as to adapt it to the re- quirements of the Borough. The recommendation of the Committee was adopted. THE APPOINTMENT OF TOWN CRIER. On the motion of Mr. Rouw, seconded by Mr. Tegid Owen, Mr. R. H. Jones, stationer, Clwyd Street, was appointed Town crier at a salary of 10s. per annum. The only other ap- plicant was Mr. Robert Roberts, Lon Fawr, Ruthin. REPORT OF COUNCIL IN COMMITTEE. The Council met in Committee on the 1st inst, when it was resolved, that the payment of the Gas Company's bill of JE73 17s. 6d. be de. ferred, uutil the enamelled iron signs placed on certain gas lamps in the borough, without the authority of the Council, are removed. Re- solved also, that the Borough collector be re- quested to make special effort to get in the outstanding rates before the end of the finan- cial year, and that he be requested to attend a meeting of the Council in Committee on the 23rd, and bring with him a list of the defaul- ters. The medical officer reported to the Com- mittee that during the preceding month six deaths and five births were registered-the deaths being due to natural causes. The Borough Surveyor also reported that he had received a reply from the railway authorities that the approaches to the bridge in Well St., would receive attention. It was resolved that Messrs. Williams, brothers, be applied to for payment of the sum of 20s. compensation for damage done to certain portion of the surface of Llanrhydd road, by reason of their excavating and taking away sand., and that they be reques- ted to make good such damage, and warned that proceedings will be taken against them for any similar offence in future. It was re- solved also that a communication be sent to the County Council asking them to agree to submit their claim of 9115 16s. for tiles, to arbitration by the Local Government Board. The report was, after a brief discussion adopted. ELECTION EXPENSES BILL. Mr. John Roberts had placed upon the agenda the following notice of motion :— 'To call attention to the charge of £ 117s. 6d. of Mr. Aldrich for printing, inter alia, the ballot papers (El Is.) and the charge of jE3, made by the Town Clerk for preparing and providing ballot papers which are included I in the bill of £ 11 lis. 8d. recommended by the Committee for payment and to move a resolution thereon.' On being called to move his resolution, Mr. John Roberts said there was no necessity to do I so, because í lIe Town Clerk had amended his bill according to the resolution he was going to submit. THE LETTING OF TOLLS. A BREEZE. It was reported by the Committee appointed to consider this matter, that only one tender had been received with response to the adver- tisement inviting tenders for the future collec- tion of tolls, and that being, in the opinion of the Committee much too low, it was resolved that the Council be recommended not to accept it. At a further meeting of the Committee, it was decided that the question of the collection of tolls be revised, and that a Committee of five members be appointed to consider the matter, and report, and the following be placed on the Committee-The Mayor, Messrs. R. P. Davies, John Roberts, Francis Dowell, and E. T. Hughes. Mr. Byford proposed that the whole Coun- cil should deal with the matter, which was a very important one. The Mayor: The Committee is only required to make suggestions and report. Mr. John Roberts said it was very strange that if this question was so important. Mr. Byford should absent himself from the meeting of the Committee, at which the recommenda- tion now made was passed unanimously. Mr. Byford I am not able to attendso often as you Mr. Councillor John Roberts. Mr. John Roberts: No, you do not make the same sacrifice as I do. Mr. Byford I do make a sacrifice. Mr. Rouw: Order, gentlemen, order order. Mr. Byford: I hope the Mayor will call 'order' and not any other member of the Council (hear, hear). We are not a meeting of children (laughter and hear, hear). We are here to represent the ratepayers, although we are not able to agree on all matters. The Mayor said these remarks were very un- seemly and were neither a credit to the Council, or to the advantage of the ratepayers. He hoped they would desist from making such remarks (hear, hear). The report of the Committee was then adop- ted. FIXING ADVERTISEMENTS ON LAMP POSTS. LIVELY DISCUSSION. The next business on the agenda was to con- sider a letter from Mr. Tickle of the Wynnstay Hotel, with reference to advertising signs placed by him upon three lamp posts in the borough. Mr. John Roberts pointed out that a report of a Committee had been adopted to the effect that the Council should not pay the bill of the Gas Company, until these signs were removed, and he therefore took it that they were not in order in discussing the matter any further. Mr. T. J. Roberts: It being on the agenda, I think, the letter ought to be read. The Mayor concurred in this view, and the letter was read. In it Mr. Tickle made a re- quest to the Council that the advertising signs be allowed to remain, as at present fixed, for which he would be prepared to pay a small amount annually, subject to three months notice on each side. Mr. John Roberts again asked whether it was in order to consider this request, the Coun- cil having already decided not to pay the Gas bill until such signs were removed. The Town Clerk There is certainly a resolu- tion on the books that the amount of the Gas bill be not paid until such sigah are removed, but he had put this matter on the agenda as a request from Mr. Tickle himself. Mr. T. J. Roberts I take it that the resolu- tion passed by the Finance Committee, and agreed to by the Council refers to the arrange- ment between the Council and the Gas Com- pany, but they were open to fresh communica- tions on the matter with Mr. Tickle. Mr. R. P. Davies said he was of the same opinion. Mr. John Roberts pointed out that when the bill of the Gas Company came before the Finance Committee, that Committee was of -opinion that the advertisement boards on the lamp posts were an innovation in the borough, and should not be tolerated. Mr. Byford said that if that was so, he would not have voted for the resolution. It seemed to him that the minutes were misleading on the subject. Mr. Edward Roberts, referring to the resolu- tion of the Committee not to pay the £ 73 due to the Gas Company said, that the Company would probably take legal proceedings to com- pel the Council to pay the bill. That being so, the Council could not put up the fact of theae signs being placed on the Jamp-posts as a set off claim against it. Mr. Tickle was now making a fresh and independent claim, and it had nothing whatever to do with the arrange- ment that existed between the Town Council and the Gas Company. Mr. R. P. Davies: It is my opinion that we have no right whatever to interfere in this mat- ter. We pay the Gas Company simply for light. How they give us that light is another matter. T'ie Mayor said the question had now assumed a different aspect altogether. Previously Mr. Tickle had put up the signs without communi- cating with or receiving the authority of the Council to do so. Now, however, he wanted the Council to take a certain consideration from him for putting up the advertisement boards, and he would rule that it was in order to discuss the matter then. Mr. T. J. Roberts said it viould be well to know whether the gas bill covered anything more than the light alone. In Manchester, Liverpool and other towns, the Gas Company were only responsible for the supply of light. The Town Clerk said that the Council paid rent for every lamp-post. Mr. T. J. Roberts: Can you produce the bill, Mr. Town Clerk? The Mayor This is beside the question"alto- gether. I rule it is in order for us to take this application now under our consideration. Mr. R. P. Davies Who repairs the lamp posts? Town Clerk: The Gas Company. The Mayor, after further discussion proposed that the sign boards belonging to Mr. Tickle be allowed to remain on the lamp posts, on payment of a certain sum annually, but that he be asked to attach them with such applian- ces as to prevent them making so much noise. It was in his opinion most unfortunate to create a disturbance of this kind with a new comer into the town. A man who did good for the town, and was evidently eminently res- pectable. He failed to see that these sign- boards trespassed upon themselvas or anybody else. Mr. T. J. Roberts seconded. Mr. John Roberts asked if tradesmen wished to advertise a sale or anything of tihat kind, were the Council poing to give them per- mission to hang these advertisements on the lamp-posts. If such permisson was given to Mr. Tickle, he failed to see why a distinction should be made by refusing such permission to other tradesmen in the town. The Mayor: The sign-boards simply act as finger-posts, and are really not advertisements. Mr. John Roberts said he would vote against the motion, because it created a precedent which the Council would be sorry for in the future. He did not think that any corporate body in the United Kingdom would rent lamp. post for advertising purposes and particularly so in Ruthin, when they had invited tenders for the advertising boards in the (own. It would not be fair towards the man to whom these were let, that t-he,e lamp posts should be used for advertising purposes. Mr. Edward Roberts said he had great pleasure in supporting the resolution, and he was surprised why any objection was raised to it. It seemed to him that a dead set was being made against strangers coming into the town. Mr. T. J. Rouw pointed out that one of the sign-boards in question had been placed on the lamp-post opposite the entrance to the CaBtle Hotel, which he thought was rather too bad, and if that were removed, he did not think there might be much opposition.