Symud i'r prif gynnwys
Cuddio Rhestr Erthyglau

26 erthygl ar y dudalen hon

BANGOR MILITARY TRIBUNAL

Newyddion
Dyfynnu
Rhannu

BANGOR MILITARY TRIBUNAL STL DENTS AS <X>XS( IENTIOUS OBJECTOIS. PECULIAR NOTIONS OF PATRIOTIC SERVICE, A meeting of the Tribunal was held or Tuesday eveliiiia at the Town Hali. Tho Mayor (llr R. J. Williams) presided and the ct-her members in attendance wero Messrs H. C. Vincent, W. I). Hobe*>n, T. J. Wil- liams, James Cumraing, T. E. Taylor, with the Military Representative (Dr. R. W. shillips) and the Cl-erk (Mr Pentir, Williams). Richard Butler (24), motor and cab driver, 08, High-street, claimed exemption. Hie ipplicant had been examined by the Wrex- fta-m Medical Board, who passed him B2, but (}-fl. Thomas certifteel him as unfit for heavy work. The Tribunal crderod him to be re- ;xa.miued by the Special Medical Board at jeeds, who confirmed the decision of the Wr<j:;ham Tribunal. The Military Representative expressed sur- prise", judging by what he had heard, that the r.pplicart had retained in Class B2. He wa. assured that the applicant woui-d not stand the Army diet a month owing to lis condition. n Exemption until June 30tih was given the i-pplieant, who was represented by Mr J. vang Jenos. Wriiliam Thomas Williams 9, Mount-street, •Tianager of Mr \¡V, üw{'u's' :lGU, who on a second examination at Wrexham was reduced from B1 to B3, was exempted unjtil June 30th. CLAIMS BY FISHERMEN. The case of T. Elias Pi.ice fisherman, Uppev Garth-road, who was 0 Appam" when "the vessel waR captuIíe{ Y the Ger- mans and v. ho gave a promise ai to take tip arms against tnem, was reviewed. m f Lieut -Commander Collard, of the Board of &.grieui,ure and Fuheries, appeared in sup- port of the claim. Price, in reply to Mr Vincent, stated that he had lac largest fishing boat in Bangor. Mr Vincent: Yes, but do you fish?—Yes, ,U t ?".O YOU I am the only licensed fifshernmn in Bangor. Mr V ucent: much iisii have you caught lately?—I never kept count of them. Mr Vincent: W onld I be right in saying that yc-u have caught .£20 worth?—Yes, and more. I have earned enough to get a living. Mr Vincent: Will you give an undertaking that the (ish you catch will be sold in Bangor? —Oh, yes, if I get a better price for them in Bai-igor than I can get anywhere else (lan gliten. Lieut.-Commander Collard said it was true that Price was not a whole-time fisherman, let he was so keen on his work that he was prepared to instai n motor in a is boat and to pay for that would keep him busy. He was also on parole, and the Military Repre- sentative would agreo that he was hardly eligible for military service for that reason. Mr Vincent You do not think it un- reasonable that we should attach a condition that he should sell his fish in Bangor pro- Tiding he gets a reasonable price? Lieut.-Commander Collard: I am sure Price would he willing to conform with that. Mr V inoent: I am told that Price seldom uses his boat, and that he has not landed JS20 worth of fish during the winter. He devotee his time picking mussels which he sends to the English markets. Conditional exemption was allowed. Mr Hobson pointed out to the applicant that his ocrtificate could be challenged by the Military Representative if he did not • carry out the contract to sell his fish in Ban- gor provided he received a reasonable price. Two other fishermen, Harold Griffiths, 14, Upper Garth-road, and Harold Williams, Garth, who were also exempted, had their certificates reviewed, being under 31 years of age. MT Vincent stated he was told that these applicants were the only fishermen whosold fish in Bangor. j On-o of the applicants said he &old .£25 worth of fish each week to a Bangor fish- monger. They would shortly have to go to fish in the neighbourhood of Pwllheli. Mr Vincent: Will you sell your fish there? -No, I am bound to sell it to a Bangor dealer. The Mayor: There is not much danger of that. Fish is so much cheaper in Pwllheli (laughter). Conditional exemption was allowed both appl icants. Ilicliard Griffith Evans (25), accounts clerk lkt fjhe University College of North Wales, B2.—June 30th, to join the Volunteers. Wm. Roberts, tailor, 32, Holyliead-road, Upper Bangor, Bl.—June 30th. Arthur Lewis Humphreys (29), grocer's assistant. Cartrefle, Upper Bangor.—Condi- t i on. tional t^em ption. Richard Emyr Humphreys, master baker, The Lawn, College-road.—-Conditional exemp- j tion. R. T. Owen, grcrcer's carter, 10, Water- street, Hirael, C2.—June 30th. Griffith Wynne Owen (18), medical stu- dent, Ty Gwyu, Upper Ban, cor. -Au gust 14th. Among the cases reviewed was that of Mr E. V. Breen Turner (29), Tanygraig, who Jiad been given conditional exemption. It was stated there are only three dentists left in the town. The certificate of conditional exemption was confirmed.* Robert D. Foulkes (30), slate," mason and stone hand, 20, Fountain-street.—June 30th. A PATRIOTIC ACTION. Josiah Palferman (35), greengrocer and fraiterer, High-street, claimed exemption, and was given conditional exemption. He Jucid-entally mentioned that he had prevented two potato-less weeks in the city by distri- buting among the other dealers a supply of potatoes he had received. Mr T. T Williams: A very patriotic act. There is far too much selfishness in this country. Wm. H. Edwards, house decorator, 244, High-street —June 30th. John Parry, coal carter, Albert-street, Up- per Bangor, Cl.-Conditional exemption. The fcpplioattt was asked whether he had joined Mte Volunteers. He replied that a man who Carried six or seven tons of coal on his back I\8ch day could not be expected to drill at ii t. Wm. Riqhard Williams (41)0; market gar- leaer, 67. Caelleppa, employed by Messrs W. K. Roberts, Market Hall, for 27 years.-Con- litional exemption. Evan Jones, carter, 10, Water-street, Hir- .(À)Iidiûonal exemption. John Butler, general carrier and motor- »r proprietor, West End.-Exempti..on con- firmed. THEOLOGICAL STUDENTS CLAIM EXEMPTION. VIEWS OF CONSCIENTIOUS OBJECTORS. Several students from the Bala-Bangor In- dependent College and the North Wales Bap- tist College applied far exemption as con- scientious objectors. A letter, sign-cd hy Principal T. Recs, Prof. Thomas Rhys, and Prof. J. Morgan Jones, wrw read. stating that they understood four of the ctudonts of the Bala-Bangor College were applying for exemption on conscientious grounds, and that they were required to pro- They came to tho College with convictions. The following facti were re- levant :—(1) They came to the college with strong testimonials from tho churohes in which they were brought up, that they had proved themselves as men of piety and sin- certty, so tha.t they had been called to devote themselves to the work of the Christian min- istry. (2) Their work and conduct since thev had been at the college had justified th 0' testimonies, and bad shown fem to be men ziot at all likely to make insincere profesi- &ion3. (:3) The religious atmosphere in which they have always lived naturally inclined their to hold those views. It was "generally aoumed and aftbn explicitly taught in Welsh Congregational Churches that to wage war was contrary to Christian principles. As evi- dence of the prevalence of that view it should he mentioned that tho Welsh CoThgregaiional Union papsed resolutions iu 1913 and 1914 de- claring all war t8 Jx* contrary to the spirit of Christ. J4) The view would be still more pre- va lent rtriid mcr-o strongly held that men who ■had been called to the work of the ministry should mot take part in war. In the Congre- gational churches there was no hard and fast iine of demarcation between the student for the ministry and the minister. Once a man had been oalled by a church and adopted by ttie denomination to be a preaqher, he might be called upon to perform every part of the work of a minister. COMPLETING THEIR STUDIES. I Richard loyd Matthews :t8), a student at tlv» Bala-Bangor Independent College, was &iven exemption twelve months ago, and his ca.-3 was re-considered in aocordance with tho new ru e o' the Army Council lie said he was finishing his studies at tho college next June, and was negotiating for a church now. The Military Representative said the appli- cant as a conscientious objector wa-s exempt. Mr Vincent: His comscientious objection has never l)1-cn advanced here. The Mayor stated that exemption would be granted until June 30th, on the ground that the. al,plicant w-as in his la.-Jt year as a minis- terial student. If lie liked, the applicant oould appeal en ooueckntious grounds. Another student, Griffith Jones, 4, Vron- heulog, who will finish his studios in June, was also exempted. Exemption until Juno 30th was given Dd. Aleirion Lloyd and Llewelyn Christmas Jones, both of the Bala-Bawgor College, who are i:ni'-ihins» their college careers in June, and to Wm. M. George, Madryn, Hclyhead-road* and Wm. I). WatkinA, Baptist (Jollogo stu- dents who are also in their last year. OBJECTION TO OATH OF ALLEGIANCE. I Ebenosoi' Charles (2C)t 2, Mountain View, student at the Bala-Bangor College, snd a l.ative of Llanellv, claimed exemption on con- scientious grounds. lie objected to non- combatant service because it helped directly e:her people to carry c.n tlhe war, and be- cause it meant taking an oath of allegiance t;. an earthly being. He earnestly believed that it was wrong to make a vow of abso- lute obedience to any man. He objected to participate in any uee ot arms in any dispute, whatever the circuinstanoos, and however just the cause might be, because in his es- timation it was in tho first plaoo futile, and, 6econdlv a direct contradiclioll in tcrm& to second ?i ?htiug for justioo with material weapons. He was not willing to join any branch of military servioo whether it was engaged in tlie destruction or the saving of life, bccause it was a military service, and to partake in it involved becoming part of the military machine. He had been taught from his youth to follow these principles, and had been brought up in an atmosphere foreign to militarism in every form. He was wiiiing to do Y.M C.A. work or educational work, or any service which did not promote wax and whioh was not under military control. Mr T:iylor: Have S-úu told the churches where you preach that you are a conscientious objector?—By preaching the gospel of Ohrist I show that. I preach tihe gospel of Christ ac- cording to what I understand it to be. Mr Vincent: That. is not an aiLsNver. Ha-ve )ou told your congregation that ?—I have told many people. Mr Vincent: In the liltlpit?- They do not call upon me to say it there. Have you told them directly? Have you or have you not?—I have not had any occa- sion to do so. I did hot ask you that. Have you told them directly? Mr T. J. Williams: Do answer the ques- tion?—I lave not. Principal Rees mei-tioned that the appli- cant was offering to do national work out- side the Army if that was the wish of the Tribunal. Mr Vincent: What kind of servioo do you buggegtr Principal Kiees: Anything but military service. Mr Vincent: Would hp join the Y.M.C.A. out in France? The Applicant: I would not mind any- thing like that. 'The Military Representative: Would you undertake Red Cress Work?—Yes, if it is outside the- Army. WOULD NOT ASSIST WOUNDED IF IT I PROMOTED WAR. Mr Vincent: Would you object to carry a wounded man off the field of battle?—Yes, if if involves taking. the military oath. Mr Vincent: It does not involve the mili- tary oatti.-I would not render assistance to tthe wounded if it promotes war. It does not promote war to assist the woundied?—Indirectly it does. Surely it is only an not of mercy which is one of the Christian principles you preach ? —It is contrary to my conscience. The Military Representative: The only pos- sibility before you is Y.M.C.A. work, and I suppose the opportunities there are limited. Then there is the Red Cross work. Mr Vincent: It is not muqh use offering Red Cross work to a man >ho"iiB hot prepared to carry off wounaed men from the field of battle. The Military Representative: He is willing to join tho Y.M.C A., which feeds men. Mr Taylor: The Y.M.C.A. is as much the Army as any other branch. You cannot separate them. Mr Vincent: How tong ha-vo you held these opinions? Are ^ou a member of the Fellow- ship of Reconciliation ?—No. So you did n-ot attend the famous meet- ing in June, 1915, which converted all you chaps (laughter)?—No. Did you do anything previous to the war to show your principles?—I had no occasion to do ao. Do you ill ink »t is wrong for us to have a Navy?—Yes. Do you think it is wrong to bring food in- country? I do mot think it is wrong, Then do you thing il- is poasiblo to bring is possi-b l o i<) brin food into tne country without a Navy? It would be poEAbi-3 if one held my views, Yes, but you must recognise tha.t everyone does not hold them. Recognising that fact, do you think it necessary to have a Navy to pro- tect our merchant vessels ?-No answer. You don't seem to have Any decided opinion (laughter). Do you think it is better that mil- lions in this country should starve for want of foodIt is wrong if our Navy promotes war. It is wrong to bring food into this oountrv 1- No answer. WILLING TO PREACH IN FRAMHR David John Howelb (24), a student at the Bala-Bangor College, who has passed Clue A, also otaimed exemption on conscientious grounds. He said he did not object to save life as a' civilian, bu.t he did object to do ao as a soldier, beoause he would then be part of an organisation wiwee business it waa to take life. He was willing to preaoh in France. Mr Vincent: And that is all! The Applicant mentioned that he was brought up on a farm. Mr Vincent: Have you done anything for your country since the war broke out?—I have U.en studying in my college. I have been fol- lowing my studies. My work, preaching on Sun- days, is of national importance. I take it. that you are paid for fcUat?-—Verj little. It hardly pays my brain fare (laugh ter). Can you name any sacrifice you have made?- No occasion has arisen demanding definite sacri- fice. Do l vou think that theological students are speciaMy exempted from making aacrincee?—No. Then tell us of one sacrifice you have made- the smallest thing that you have done for your country since tlw war broke out?—I oan't say anything definitely. is not self-sacrifice the essence of the Christianity you preach?—Yes. Then name me one act of self-sacrifice that you have done?—In undertaking to preach the Gospel I left a better position. You call that an aot of I do. I NO OBJECTION TO Y.M.C.A. WORK. Alun Garner (26), Bala-Bangor College, and staying at Victoria Park, who lias passed Claas A., contended that war waa based on hatred and rni3unidersta.nd)ing. lie had undertaken to do all he could to eatLbLisli Llilt, Kingdom of God on earth. He cookl not' accept non-comba.tant service, and was not willing to as>idt in the systematic deutruotion of liie. He had 110 objection to Y.M.C.A. work. The Mayor: You aay that war under any cir- cunutcnoes is not j ust;-fi- --Yez Mr Taylor: Irl that case it would be wrong for us to oppose tiie Germans landing in this country and commit the atrocities they have been guilty of elsewhere?—War is wrong. Mr T. J. Williams: Was it wrong for Belgium to ciefertd herself?—I hold that war —— Mr Williams: Please answer a fair and simple. question? Was it or was it not wrong for Bel- gium to defend herself f..gainst the Germans? -Yec, Defence by armaments is wrong Mr Hobson: When you say you have not been called upon to make any personal sacrifice so far do you realise that you have not been called upon to do so because obherpeople have been making sacrifices for you ?—W e make sacrifices in our own way. I have gone into the ministry, and it moans hard work and money. Mr Vincent: And that is the sum total of your sacrifice?— Y es. You cannot name a single thing that you have done, except your work in the ministry, to help your country, eirtoo the war broke out?--I say the ministry does help the country. You oannot name anything outside that work? —No. How long have you held those principles? You say you have been speciaUy impressed by them j¡<t at present, and I am not surprised at that? (laughter).—I have preao'rwxl about the futility of armaments for a long time. Do you belong to any body that professes those principles?—No. Can you recall any act of yours previous to tho war which shows that you held tho')c prin- ciples?—I have preached that, armaments were futile, and since the war I have been con- vinced of that fact. Mr Taylor: Would it be against your con- science to make any saorifioe for your country?- Not at all. The Mayor: Do you preach on this subject a.t all? -Do you mention it when you preach?— I have preached that ito material weapon can save the country. The Mayor: Have you dared to say in a Welsh pal pit that. this country was wrong, and that our men should take no pc-rt in the war? Mr Vincent: Have you preached tha.t Eng- land was wrong in taking pa.rt in this war?—I have not said that, but I have preached that war is wrong, and that England end the other countries are wrong in going into war. Mr Taylor: Would you daro teli a congrega- tion next Sunday morning that England was wrong in going to war with Germany? I cion t want to give particular instances. M.r Taylor: You would not dare do it. Principal Rees: Yes, he would. Mr Vincent: We are not speaking to you, Principal Rees. I know you would dare any- thing (,IftughtL -rl (To the Applicant): Would you dare state publicly that England was wrong in going into this war?—I would dare it inasmuch as I have condemned war. Have you said so specifically? I cannot le- rnember all the remaafcs I make. I tihink you would remember it to tho end of your days if you made such a. remark (laughter). GAVE UP A GOOD POST. I  -I Idris Vaughan Morns ll), student at trie Baptist. College, and residing a.t. 47, Holyhead- road, Uppea- Bangor, Class A, claimed exemp- tion on conscientious grounds. He stated that he rog-ardied his work at the college as a. sacrifice as he i-act given up a good post. He did so for the spiritual good of his country. He had proaoned that war was wrong. Mr Vincent: Have you ventured to say that England was wrong?—I have said it in this Mr Vincent: Very generally I suppose (iaugh- te,r).-I sav that England, having gone to war, does certainly not live up, in my opinion to the Christian convictions, which sh(3 professed before the war. Mr VinCirit: Have you said so in any sermon? —Yes. What sort of reception did you get? (laugh- te,r).-I don't know (laughter). Weoro you asked to preach in that ohapel again? (laughter). Y es. Then I suppose they liked it? I suppose so. Tho Mayor: You say you ha.ve not joined tne Fellowship of Reconciliation. If it is a good movement, why did you not support it Do you feel inclined to become a member now?—I am n-ot very keen about it. The Mayor: You would not becomo a mem- ber?-It d oes not make much difference whether I do or not. Mr Vinceht: Y m, 800m fo have very slaok opinions on the subject altogether (laughter) Since this Fellowship is likely to promote the principles you propound, don't you think you should join?- Yes, if it wou!d be of any uoe to them. THE DECISION. I The Tribunal retired, and after a long interval the Mayor statedit has taken the Tribunal some time to decide these oases, and we were anything but unanimous. In the cases of Charles, Howei?, Garner, and Morris, we have decided to allow them a month to consider what work of national importance they should take up. Thay must either take up agrioulbitre, join tha R.A.M.C., Red Cross, or the Y.M.C.A. Jf they do not do so in the course of a month, they cannot expect much mercy from the Tribunal. Mr Vincent mentioned that the decision was arrived at by the casting vote of the Mavor. The other proposal was that the applications should be dismissed because those who voted that way were not satisfied with the grounds of the objeotors.

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